Channel 88 "Programming": Abigail Aighearach Dargon FriarTuck(C) Gyro( +TM) \ {kelou} mmorris seva toddmf(TM) vek(*) 10 players are in channel 88. Aighearach(88): PerlMonks kicks ass. :) Abigail(88): Really? They don't impress me. Aighearach(88): Why not? Aighearach(88): I have found it to be an excellent place to connect wi +th other \ Perl coders. And it's a lot more friendly than #perl, and so the \ demographic is more representative of the whole. Aighearach(88): I mean, perldoc and CPAN are great, but I like to also + be able \ to discuss efficiency, and some of those More Way[s] To Do It peop +le are \ always talking about. Aighearach(88): What is it missing, Abigail? Abigail(88): Too much trivial stuff, and too much wrong stuff. Aighearach(88): we get people would wouldn't go within 12 \ miles of #perl Abigail(88): And that's a feature? ;-) Aighearach(88): It certainly is. :) Aighearach(88): Having a broad array of viewpoints is allways preferab +le. Aighearach(88): Anyhow, I saw that there was an Abigail acount, I was +hoping \ it was you, and that you would stay. I've heard you say some reall +y \ right-on things in here, and I think you would really be asset to +the \ community. Something to consider, anyway. Abigail(88): If you think I'm not part of the Perl community, then the + \ conclusion ought to be that you don't know anything about the Perl + \ community. Aighearach(88): nonono, I meant the PerlMonks community! Aighearach(88): Yes, that would be exactly the conclusion if it had be +en what \ I meant, I am sorry that I was unclear. Abigail(88): I already contribute to clp.misc, various mailinglists, Y +APC/YAS, \ and #perl. Why join yet another medium, one that has the most horr +ible \ interface you can imagine? All those webboards are truely awkward, + robbing \ you of all the features even bad news and mailreaders give you. Aighearach(88): Well, the great thing about perl monks is that it is \ interactive. If you wrote a non-browser interface, you would get t +he Love \ and Appriciation of all the Perl Monks. Aighearach(88): so far there are just a slew of clients for the "chatt +erbox". Abigail(88): That non-browser interface has existed for 20 years. It's + called \ Usenet. Aighearach(88): hahahaha Aighearach(88): I will assume that was a joke, since you were just tal +king \ about "features." Abigail(88): news readers give me features a webboard doesn't give. An + \ extremely important feature: *not* showing me articles I've alread +y read. Aighearach(88): ah HA! Yes, that is a very important feature indeed! Abigail(88): Another vital one: killfiles. Aighearach(88): What if there was a usenet gateway for it? Would that +make you \ more receptive to participation? Aighearach(88): May I have permission to share you comments on the Per +lMonks \ site? Aighearach(88): s/you/your/ Abigail(88): Perhaps. It certainly won't move me away from it. But the +n, I \ already spend a few hours a day on clp.misc, #perl and the mailing +lists. Abigail(88): I've viewed my opinions on the interface on slashdot and \ use.perl.org (which is yet another slashdot copy-cat). People don' +t agree, \ quoting spam on usenet, while not being bothered by a animated ad +on every \ web page. Aighearach(88): Yeah, I use a proxy to filter the ads. :) Abigail(88): Urg! Perlmonks require me to scroll horizontally! Aighearach(88): Use lynx. ;) Aighearach(88): There is setting for forced code wrapping width, but i +t hasn't \ been extended to all the width problems yet. vroom is adding a lot + of \ features and fixes, so it has been improving. Abigail(88): Ah, the frontpage has an article that gives another reaso +n not to \ like Perlmonks. It indicates it's ok to ask FAQs and to not have r +ead the \ manual. Aighearach(88): No. Aighearach(88): That is an ongoing discussion. Aighearach(88): That main consensus is that the correct response is to + point \ to the documentation in question, rather than flaming the person. Aighearach(88): Guidance, as opposed to stone throwing. Aighearach(88): Not everybody is going to be at the same capability, a +nd \ programming shouldn't be only for the elitists. Abigail(88): Saying RTFM *is* someone pointing to the documentation. ; +-) Aighearach(88): hahaha, RTFM [link] does it. Abigail(88): And besides, reading the manual isn't for elitists. Readi +ng the \ manual is common sense. Whether it is for operating a VCR, driving + a car, \ or programming a language. Aighearach(88): But some people don't even know where the manual IS... + instead \ of kicking them in the shins, and leaving them as lame and clueles +s as \ when they walked in, we try to at least help them get in there. Aighearach(88): Common sense isn't common, though. Dargon(88): I enjoy reading manuals when I become extremely bored. Aighearach(88): Dargon, there is hope for you yet. ;) Dargon(88): *Grin* Abigail(88): Just like that the manual comes with your VCR or your car +. Aighearach(88): I know, but some people don't know it's there! Some pe +ople are \ used to M$ Visual Studio, and crap like that... Aighearach(88): If a forum can a person from the bottom, up to the top +, \ without running off anybody not born with asbestos skin, then it o +f course \ is going to be the idea resource. Abigail(88): *shrug* Still, even if you bother to listen/read in the n +ewsgroup \ or #perl (and hopefully perlmonks) before asking trivial questions +, you \ will be aware there's an excellent manual. Aighearach(88): Yes, but not everybody is the best case. Aighearach(88): As in any field, there is a place for people of all \ skill/intelligence levels. Isn't there? Abigail(88): You are suggesting Perlmonks is aiming at the low end of +the \ scale? ;-) Aighearach(88): hehe, no, I am saying it is aiming to be inclusive. It + is \ aiming to be able to help both the fresh baby coder who doesn't ev +en know \ what RTFM means, and also to help the seasoned coder, who is seeki +ng an \ insight into how x aspect of y module should be used in z context. Dargon(88): Human Intelligence is over rated. Aighearach(88): or at least over stated... Abigail(88): So be it, but all this combined is enough reason for me t +o hardly \ get involved into Perlmonks. I glance over the frontpage every few + days, \ but I read every article on clp.misc (unless my killfile got it) a +nd spend \ a lot of time on #IRC. Abigail(88): s/#IRC/#perl/ Aighearach(88): So if there was any one thing that would make you more + likely \ to use PerlMonks in one form or another, what would it be? Abigail(88): 1) Better interface. 2) More interesting articles. FAQs a +nd \ trivial things that can be found straight in the manual are just a + big \ waste of time (not only from the question itself, but also from al +l the \ wrong answers given by people who haven't read the manual either). Aighearach(88): Thanks. :) BTW, there are lots of interesting articles +... \ maybe a system where the higher level users could mark an article +based on \ the exerience level of the topic might help.
Paris Sinclair | 4a75737420416e6f74686572 pariss@efn.org | 205065726c204861636b6572 http://sinclairinternetwork.com
In reply to RE: Free Open Source Everything?
by Aighearach
in thread Free Open Source Everything?
by antihec
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