in reply to Ideas for PerlMonks Themes

Ok... Maybe an interactive theme configurator is a little much to ask for at this point but ... <rant>Why does every theme have to emulate paper?!? A traditional book or printout doesn't radiate and thus cook my eyeballs... If paper beamed into your sockets, you wouldn't want to stare at it very long. It's hard to read a book in the dark... so since you need external illumination, black text on white paper makes a lot of sense. Now when we've entered a different realm where gazing in the dark is entirely feasible, we should resist the urge to mimic old ways. It seems so very simple yet it must not be ... command-line interfaces had it right (usually)... with light gray text on a black background... let our eyes focus on the light rather than the miniscule absence of it and they will itch and burn less... Computer displays are not paper! Don't force webpages or any other interface you design to adhere to such an antiquated paradigm! I guess what I'm trying to say is: Please make a theme with teal text on a deep navy (nearly black) background... white text here, yellow text there... the light colors are eye attractions and they're much more comfortable for me... I would assume that others feel similarly or just haven't ever thought about it or actually prefer scorched eyeballs... I'm aiming to someday write a Perl script that filters every site I specify in my browser so that I won't have to be dismayed by the color options of /. and perlmonks... arstechnica has it right... </rant> Sorry if I went on and on and ... about something as relatively trivial as the most important method for receiving data back from your computer and information from the net... I relapse into oblivion only to recover into abyss whence I climb up to chaos and plunge among ether. Stick some chopsticks next to me... I'm done. TTFN & Shalom.

-PipTigger

Replies are listed 'Best First'.
RE: RE: Ideas for PerlMonks Themes
by neshura (Chaplain) on Mar 20, 2000 at 00:52 UTC
    I have to disagree strongly with piptigger -- this dark theme makes my eyes water and burn, especially because of the complete lack of contrast in the nested comments. I don't know of any research on usability that says black on white is less readable than white on black, but I KNOW that grey/yellow on white is virtually impossible to read. (I only read arstechnica when absolutely necessary.)

    Adjust your brightness/contrast so the monitor doesn't hurt your eyes. Get a glare filter. Buy a flat panel. The problem is not the site design, it's the fact that computer monitors are just not good for your eyes.

    I hate to even comment on this at all, because as vroom says, he's got more pressing things to do than worry about prettifying the site.

    (I do like the idea of a medieval theme. I have many artist friends. Maybe one of 'em would volunteer.)

    e-mail neshura

      I hate light-on-dark text viewing. Humans like myself are diurnal creatures, used to viewing things in the light. Command line interfaces use light-on-dark because back when the first command lines were developed, white was expensive. Remember when computer monitors were all black with green or orange text? It's (obviously) not as easy to read black on flourescent green as it is to read green on black, but at the same time it's easier to read black on white than just about anything on black. White gives the impression of clean emptyness.
        Obviously light gray or bright yellow on white is not what I was advocating but either of those text colors on a very dark one look mighty fine AFAIC. Now, I've looked up diurnal like a good nerd should (and saw that it was blatantly apparent from context after the fact)... and I guess this isn't as much of a no-brainer as it seems. Obviously people are different and maybe average human beings are predominantly aroused during the daytime however... (I'm sorry if this all sounds too stereotypical but it is such because it is true in many cases) a large percentage of coders and a larger percentage of hackers (ie. $japh x 65535) find their productivity and concentration increase when undisturbed within the stillness of night. I used to work for a lame web hosting company and it was impossible to code anything really useful during the day... intercom page-alls every couple of minutes about sports scores or somebody on line 7... then you've got people who need you to help them with their computer because it needs a file cleanup on drive c: every couple of seconds or their mouse isn't working properly (needs to be cleaned) and they're afraid of breaking it or touching the wrong keys and watching the puter blow up. It wasn't the ideal situation and it was pretty sad that I was their only coder and also the most informed employee regarding hardware configuration/repair issues (not that I know very much about anything other than cutting edge gaming hardware) ... long story short ...
      days are loud, disturbed, and busy in a typical office... nights can be focused, intense, and far more productive when it comes to writing code. (<tangent> I love staring at code so long while malnourished and sleep deprived that I sense vertigo before my monitor =) </tan>) Also, working nights means that one can likely be immersed in electronica or classical or whatever you prefer without sweaty headphones on and there are no neighbors or family members to awake (since most offices are in commercial districts nicely removed from the residential burbclaves) ... so maybe I'm an immature lamer script kiddie whose security blanket is my resemblance of every typical hacker (although not quite as perv as Mouse in Matrix) ... maybe I'm not all or any of those things but I do think this issue is intimately fundamental to every interaction with a computing device. How will we tell it what we want it to do? How will we know that it did it? My main point is that screens don't have to destroy or offend onlooker's eyes... maybe it's like hard plastic seats at McDon's or BurgerChum where they don't want you to get too comfortable so you won't want to lounge about and clutter the dining room so others can buy and dine ... I don't know about you but when the whole thing is actually glaring, radiating, electron beams a beaming and cathode rays arraying) I'd rather focus on a little bright text than gape at fluorescence while trying to dial pupils into a little dark text. Thanks for reading my long winded %re of why I think what I think (and for enduring my poor paragraphing ability). I welcome any further discussion regarding this issue since I feel so passionately about it. I'll try to be open minded but I don't like it when dust gets in there (maybe I need a Microsoft optical intellibrain with lasereye technology). TTFN & Shalom.

      -PipTigger
RE: RE: Ideas for PerlMonks Themes
by vroom (His Eminence) on Mar 19, 2000 at 23:11 UTC
    Go to user settings now and check out the dark theme... it has some issues but let me know what you think... I need to design some titlebar graphics but since I'm on a laptop for the week I don't feel particularly compelled to do any gimping at this moment. However if you wanted to convert the perlmonks title image and search image I could plug those in fer ya.
      I must say that I like the dark theme tremendously ... actually I'm more impressed with the promptness with which you produced the option. Thank you Vroom! The title bar is fine for now (or so it seems to me... I'd be glad to help unify color themes if you would like... I don't have the ability to make new gifs until Tue evening or Wed afternoon but I'd love to help... I'll design other themes after that if you would like. Mail me about it) ... the most apparent transgression of this new dark theme has been the white background in the table which holds all the replies to a thread... the text and table colors elsewhere are far better than any of the previous theme options as far as I'm concerned. Nice work. TTFN & Shalom.

      -PipTigger
        the most apparent transgression of this new dark theme has been the white background in the table which holds all the replies to a thread...

        I recently switched to the dark theme, but I have the same complaint as above - the threads are quite unreadable. Any chance of homogenizing the theme soon? Thank you.

      I love the darker theme!

      The only change I would make is to the color of the hyperlinks (both visited and unvisited). They seem a little clashy. I don't like this theme as much as the blue theme, for my laptop, but when I plug it into my 21" sun monitor -- it looks very pleasing.

      I'm really thankful for this site and can't wait to see what it grows into over the next few months. Everything(2) were interesting ideas, but PerlMonks is really a brilliant implementation. I bet Andover is already licking their lips and pulling out the cash. *grin*

RE: RE: Ideas for PerlMonks Themes
by setantae (Scribe) on Mar 19, 2000 at 22:20 UTC
    Well, you could always use lynx...