If experience points are really supposed to be a measure of experience with the monastery, even posting a *bad* question -- and receiving feedback -- should grant that.

If someone new shows up and doesn't know exactly how things will work but posts anyway only to be knocked down to -10 points, is the poster likely to post again? Or will he perceive that the monastery is full of self-righteous old boys like me?

We have at least two mechanisms in place to guide the behavior of posters, voting and comments. I suggest the latter as more generous and less shocking to new posters.

You have a good diagnosis, but I think there's an easier solution. Don't record negative XP against users under level 2.

Hmm...I suppose that would achieve much the same end; after all, the principal purpose of voting is to reflect the quality of the node, not the poster.

Bearing that in mind, the only advantage of a `newbie corner' would be to segregate much of the chaff so that the 'self-righteous old boys' don't have to plough through it unless they really want to.

Personally, I don't mind reading that sort of stuff, but I'm sure there are more than a few old-timers who are fed up with seeing the same FAQs popping up time and again.

-- 
flay, here to learn

Maybe we could put some volenteers in charge of anwsering newbie questions?

Namely, we need to make certain that we're using our moderation tools appropriately. This means we may need to use the tools, especially consideration, more judiciously.

As I argued earlier, the Delete Consideration is a very serious action. When a node gets reaped, it means that several members of the community thought the material was worthless.

"That's our right," you cry. "It was."

Okay, but "worthless" is a pretty serious charge.

"It's a troll," you respond.

Okay, but take a look at your first post here or the first newsgroup post you made when you were learning Perl. Now, ask yourself how you would have felt if it had been reaped? Be honest with yourself.

Now, ask yourself if it's at all possible that someone may think we're rebuking them, that we don't want their kind here (y'know, "newbies"), or that they're not worthy of our assistance?

Extremes? Yes. True? Not as I understand the Perl community. However...consider:

• In politics, the appearance of impropriety can ruin your career.

• In civil service, the appearance of a conflict of interest can get you censured.

• In business, the appearance of sexual harassment can lead to a lawsuit and a pink slip.

Getting my drift?

We must avoid the appearance of superiority, arrogance, and intolerance; otherwise, we risk driving away the new members that can enervate and energize our community.

While the Approval nodelet is easy to use, you should first see who's posting the node. If it's a new AM or initiate, then *please* do the following before tossing it into Consideration:

• Vote it down to see what the current Rep is. If it's positive, then don't consider the node. I wouldn't even consider it until it's rep. hits double negative digits.

• See if there are any replies. If so, then forget considering it. A thread has been started and the replies can provide any required correctional activities.

• See who posted it, if it's the first post by an initiate, then use it an opportunity to welcome them to the community and hand them a basket of nodes they should read.

• If you decide to consider a questionable node, then have the courtesy to provide a reason and the courage to take credit.

• If you decide to consider a questionable node, then follow up and track how the other monks respond. Many "useless," "duplicate," and "off-topic" nodes are now under consideration and it's interesting to see how the votes have gone. This is valueable feedback to the person who considered the node. Use it.

When you moderate content, please remember that you're not only protecting our little community from the trolls of the world, you're also providing feedback to the original poster. And some posters may take that feedback to heart and never return because their honest question was "terminated with extreme prejudice."

Therefore, please moderate questionable nodes with an eye toward the quality of feedback you're providing to the original poster. We're supposed to be an open community willing to help people learn the language and how to contribute to its success and community. We're not going to do that if we're hard to get into, unforgiving, or pissy.

And it that's how we want to come across, then we're doing a disservice to Perl and the people that have made it what it is today. (I don't believe that's what we really want, but I do see the possibility that some people make take us that way.)

Even if you've seen the question asked a zillion times, the poster hasn't or they (most likely) wouldn't have asked. Even if it is a duplicate question, give them a link or several. Don't just delete it out of hand.

If you're going to moderate, then moderate responsibly. Do the research to fiond the answers and reply to the poster the way you would want to be replied to. Every contact is an opportunity.

If you find this a burden, then don't moderate. Period.

Our more experienced members may already know this, but I offer it for the younger monks. In Sales, it's said that "The first impression makes or breaks the sale."

I like to put it slightly differently: "Sense isn't Common, Neither is Courtesy. Cultivate Both."

--f

P.S. I chose to reply to this thread because I didn't want to sidetrack the other one from the direction it's moving. This one's closer to the spirit of what I wanted to address.

I do however exhaust every other means of information mining before I post here in respect to the systems and principles of this site that I yet know hardly anything about.

While I do think a newbie section may be useful, what would it contain? Probably the first chapter of a few good Perl books, why not just read/get those and have the information on hand 24/7. I think newbies would learn a lot more by ploughing through introductory Perl documentation as they don't always know what they want to know, they are just plagued by a drowning confusion of where to start.

An area where newbies can ask questions without fear of being scolded or flamed could help the few of us that just need a different perspective during our time of learning.

It would also be a great boost to the newbies (myself included) when we go...Hey!! I can help with that! I know the answer!!!!. Unfortunately most of the advanced code I see here still looks like line noise (but I am getting better!).

puts down the chalk and walks away from the board